FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Magfed 20mm Rifles










https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportun...0&cck=1&au=&ck

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

For reference, here is the Anzio Ironworks Magfed 20mm rifle:
http://www.anzioironworks.com/images/20-mm.jpghttp://www.anzioironworks.com/images...atangle-FP.jpg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

oh, good lord!
they have a take-down version, too!
personally, i'd like the extra weight on the rifle, plz.
http://www.anzioironworks.com/20incase1.jpg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

....................

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

holy shyte !

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

" I ask gentlemen, sir, what means this martial array, if its purpose be not to force us to submission? Can gentlemen assign any other possible motive for it?....

They are meant for us: they can be meant for no other."

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Dam

The recoil on that Bit*h must be one....

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Anzio uses 20x102mm Vulcan rounds.

Before 1968 you could buy a Lahti L-39: 20�138mm via mail order for $100.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

its fer tha terraists son...dont'cha fret.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I need one of those! How much are they?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Have no problem them buying as long as I can buy


http://meatman.smugmug.com/Other/gun...9_EXXAy-X2.jpg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

http://www.ohioordnanceworks.com/mis...46%20lahti.jpg

.223/.338 Lapua/.50BMG/20mm x 102
http://www.anzioironworks.com/images/bulletsizes.jpg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

A shoulder-fire weapon where the projectile has a rotating band. Interesting.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Is the FBI expecting armored resistance? What ever would give them THAT idea? :biggrin:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Just looked up the specs... HOLY SHIT!!!

1,543 grain projectile at 3400 FPS...

Enough to ruin ANYONE's day! :biggrin:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I guess they were reading the 'home build tank' thread here.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

JJ, we must run in the same email circles, I recieved this this morning.

My thoughts:

With only two rifles it could only be for test/trial, or

It could be that someone at Anzio has a brother in law in the FBI kicking them some dough, or

They already have a specific target picked out.


Anyone else?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

The FBI intends to procure the following items:


Magfed 20mm Rifle with Belgian Camo Overcoat finish. Includes bipod, brake, handguard, free floated barrel and case (Qty: 1 each)


Magfed 20mm Rifle with Navy NWV Camo Duracoat finish. Includes bipod, brake, handguard, free floated barrel and case (Qty: 1 each)


Non-firing bolt assemblies (Qty: 2 each)

Extra magazines (Qty: 4 each)

Suppressors in 20mm (Qty: 2 each)
http://world.guns.ru/sniper/ntw20_1.jpg

http://world.guns.ru/sniper/sn55-e.htm



http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/2364/ffffuuuu.jpg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Maybe they're afraid of Montanans having 20mm (or larger) rifles and want to do some testing to see what they might be up against.

From the Montana Firearms Freedom Act (http://data.opi.mt.gov/bills/2009/billhtml/HB0246.htm):

1 1/2 inches is 38.1mm. Maybe the FBI needs to buy a 30mm rifle too...

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Actually, you can. They are destructive devices under the NFA, so there is paperwork and a tax stamp, but if you want one you can buy one.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,The question is -- WHO does the FBI want to TAKE OUT that they would need that weapon to do it ?:questionm:questionm:questionm

That is one HELL of a GUN -- damn near a FIELD PICE!:36_1_25::yes:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

And isn't each round of 20mm ammo also considered a "destructive device", requiring registration?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I believe so.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

All mothers with young children better watch out.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby_Ridge

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s...leston_APC.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s...ts/goons01.jpg
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s...k_with_M60.jpg

1949
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s.../group1949.jpg

2009
http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s..._police_70.jpg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

It would be nice to hear from somebody who knows for sure. Maybe the Anzio website says but I can't go look right now.

My personal memory on this one is that the solid projectiles aren't DD's. So the blue 20mm like the Vulcan gunners use for practice. It would be ones with explosives inside that are DD's.

I could be wrong!!

Gregg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Thats why I said I have no problem with the FBI having these

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

How Much will that set you back?

E-A

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

dam now they can kill people in our country an be a mile away

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

$6800 for the take-down version with practice rounds at $10 each.........I'm still saving FRN's to buy a Fifty-Cal and then this big azz gun shows up !

$11,900 for the Mag fed version.

http://www.anzioironworks.com/MAG-FED-20MM-RIFLE.htm

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

(1543 x 3400 x 3400) / 450,000 = 39,600 Ft - Lbs of energy.....that's ONLY a little over 13X a 30.06 than can kill out at 1000 yards.

50 BMG is about 12,500 Ft-Lbs (about 4X a 30.06).

Why do they need so much? Like a 50 BMG sniper round is not enough? Perhaps it is for sniping vehicles?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

The Gun shop by my old house had one of these anzio rifles in the store. They had an annual shoot (employees and family) where they took it out and shot it. They're shooting it in the first part of the video, starts around 20 seconds in.


I was talking to the guys in the shop about it (after they showed me this video on their computer) and they said its fun to shoot! BUT they also said that it costs $11/round to fire the thing.

I don't know how true this next part is, just relaying what they told me in the shop, but they said that the ammo is specially made from F-16 ammo surplus, but because the F-16 ammo is electronicly fired they have to DRILL OUT the electric primer and put in a regular pin fired primer...pretty cool though!

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

My understanding is the 20mm ammo is a DD only if it is explosive. Regular FMJ should not be subject to a tax stamp.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK, HUMmmmmmmmmm :thinkey: Perhaps the FBI just wants to TEST the presidents LIMO :yes::thinkey: to make SHURE :wink::wink: it is SAFE for HIM! :36_1_11:

False FLAG :questionm:dontknow:-- it worked for Kenedy!:thinkey: :yes: :36_1_25: :thumb.aspx:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I don't think that is accurate Bob...the NFA rule says

20mm = 0.787401575 inches so its definiately over 1/2"...ironically so is a 12 gauge shotgun hence the reason for the caveot of "the exceptions for sporting shotguns"


EDIT:

Found this at the bottom of their 20mm "take-down" page

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

nope:

also, check the BATF NFA Handbook:
http://www.atf.gov/publications/down...f-p-5320-8.pdf

So, as long as it doesn't have more than 1/4 oz explosive in it, then you're ok.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Correct. You wouldn't use a 20mm to shoot a single person in the open. You would use it when you wanted to attack fixed or moving equipment. It would also be useful in an anti-personnel role if you needed some serious penetration. So the bad guy is all barricaded into a position and shooting from tiny little slits. That 20mm is going to penetrate just about anything you could find outside of actual armor.

Gregg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Wac.o Rub.y Ridg.e they are preparing to get the last of the hold outs.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Isn't >.5" bore a Destructive device?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Enough babbling-

Have any one of you folks been to the MVPA meets? Have anyone of you ever owned any armor? Seems the MVPA folks are now targeted.On the other hand, with the current rise in militias, they may just be preparing for some "domestic terrorism" action-what is it they say, "do not bring a knife to a gunfight"?

There is only ONE reason to employ these in the arsenal-defeat armored vehicles-this is an anti-armor round.I know it could penetrate a Saracen, a Ferret, a Saladin, an M116 or M114 or any other armored vehicle that are quite numerous with collectors.Here are some pics I took at a meet a few years back.I miss Texas.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I did have a chance to fire this 88, it was a fun weekend.Are you folks supporting your local MVPA?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,917601,There are WAY more valuable targets!:yes::36_1_25:

http://thepicturevideocommunity.file...9/01/liom1.jpg

http://www.bigredlimo.com/blog/asset...e_01_580op.jpg

http://cache.gizmodo.com/assets/imag...ama-LImo-2.jpg

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Sorry, I can't agree with that.

In the first place, the blue practice rounds that civilians are buying for $10 a pop isn't an AP round. It would go through any kind of car or truck but it would just blow up on armor.

Think of WWII. Many of the combatants started out trying to use 37mm guns for anti-armor. Didn't take long before it was totally worthless. That's how they ended up using things like that 88mm. Sure, there is a difference between a Tiger and a 113 but the US Army doesn't consider the 20mm to have any role involving armor. I was in an ADA battalion and we had a bunch of towed Vulcans. Their primary mission was ADA but we also trained to use them against things like trucks and ground installations. If armored vehicles show up, you get the heck out of Dodge!

Considering the .50 BMG SLAP rounds, I'm sure there are modern 20mm rounds that have some anti-armor uses. But it would be something like WWII armored cars or some kind of homemade armor all welded together from steel plate. If the FBI really did want to take on armor, I'm fairly certain they could find a way to get some AT4's sent their way. After all, they managed to get tanks in Waco!

Gregg

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Get a ferret - nice

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct732.aspx

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I'd think that a 20mm would defeat armour, and especially if they're running DU's through it....if they were really wanted to get serious, I think they may deploy something akin to what's in my Sig Line...

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

They have TWO RIFLES.

If they were really getting ready to take on a militia with armor, they would have a LOT more.

It's either testing (they'll get a lot more later), or they have a plan to use one on a specific target.

I bet a 20mm round would do a number on a commercial jet. What was that flight that 'blew up' midair over the atlantic coming to NY?

Are there any up and coming Kennedys that fly a lot?

Where is Matt Marriot when you need him?!?!?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,eat_beef,The intent of that weapon is OBVIOUS:yes: as it is for ALL sniper weapons -- "ONE SHOT -- ONE KILL":thinkey: from very long distance and extream accuracy and PENITRATION! :36_1_25:

BTW: They can get the EXPLOCIVE rounds or DE rounds if they want them -- they are the FBI!!:thumb.aspx: :yes: :36_1_25:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

there is NO reason in the world for the FBI to NEED them ever.

like there is ZERO reason for street cops to have/need select fire m16's (or even ar15) EVER
so much for community policing.......:s10:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

1. In what part of the FBIs official mandate would they ever need a long range camo sniping weapon (notice they got two different colors)? Aren't assasinations illegal (except when unofficially done by the CIA)?

2. Just how quiet is a supressed 20mm?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I assume #1 is rethorical question.. and

#2:

http://goldismoney.info/forums/showp...3&postcount=11

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,SLV, No supressor on a long range sniper weapon:36_1_30:,the supressor would distort trajectory and by the time any one in the impact aeria does hear it:thinkey: -- they are already DEAD or too distracted to notice ware the boom came from!:thinkey::36_1_25::yes:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,JJ_, I guess I stand corected -- sort of after that clip:wink: BUT it is my understanding that a supressor would greatly deminish accuracy so wile it can be supressed the traid off in accuracy sort of negates the extream long range capability of the weapon.

IF using HE rounds no one on target will hear the boom any way! :36_1_25::452::wink:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

BUT... A supressor could help to reduce the number of witnesses to the shot. (Think grassy knoll)

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Duck, I normally ignore you, but I must adress these two issues;

A) This rifle are significantly LESS accurate than others on the market (think Cheytac, barret, etc.). Therefore, they aren't anti personel weapons, as they are less effective in that role, as well as more expensive, and draw more attention (EG, we wouldn't even be talking about this if it were a Crazy Horse, which is probably more accurate than the 20mm).


B) High quality supressors almost always provide an improvement in accuracy at any range.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,eat_beef, Usualy I just hate "IGNORENCE" :hahaha::stupido2: but in your case I find HUMOR in it! :yes::4_1_72::111:

IF a supressor actualy DID make fire arms MORE accurate then all military weapons would be SUPRESSED!:banghead::banghead: The NOISE is not a benifit in a combat situation --- accuracy IS! :yes:

The back pressure caused by the supressor distorts the trajectory of the projectial and slowes it down too!:yes::signs14:

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Yeah, uhh, that's why most of the world's armies field the AK...accuracy is the ONLY consideration.:sarc:

For anyone who would like to know what's really going on, don't take my word for it, google 'sniper rifle system suppressor', or just go to any number of websites, such as www.smithenterprise.com www.ar15.com www.snipershide.com www.eliteiron.net etc. and educate yourself.

BTW, besides your collossal ignorance of suppressed fire, you have yet to tell us why a 'one shot one kill sniper' would choose a heavier, larger, louder, more expensive (to own, operate, upkeep, and feed), and less accurate rifle in the 20mm to do what any number of weapons, from a 50 to a 416 to a 338 to a 308 could do better.:bear_rolleyes:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Gee now I remember a bar talk I had with a Gulf War ex-army sniper I had about ten years ago. He was ranting on and on and on about those 20mms he was building. Maybe the FBI finally got wind of him. Tall thin guy with long brown hair, would be about 40 now.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

QWAK,If the mission and target are important enough it is a ONE SHOT disposable weapon any way!:thumb.aspx: Say like POTUS! :yes::36_1_25:

Taking out POTUS would be a mission for such a weapon was my point all along.:thinkey:

An AK is a totaly diferent weapon wit a diferent mission -- extream apple and orange diference!

the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

That isn't true. It is an old wives tale that has been passed around for years on teh interwebs. Much like the notion that a loaded magazine suffers from spring fatigue (I love amateur engineers who use terms without understanding their meaning!).

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

The obvious reason for the 20mm is material capability and no this is not a conspiracy, it is simply a weapons acquisition. They are not taking anybody out or shooting airplanes. They are simply adding anti-material capabilities to their arsenal.

If you don't like go buy one for yourself to counter their purchase, or if you can't afford 20mm, go get a .50 BMG.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Two rifles adds anti material capability in exactly TWO places. That assumes they aren't used in tandem.

Are we really supposed to believe that the FBI, tasked with covering ALL of the US, plus basically the whole world, bought TWO rifles for their anti material needs? Are they going to fly one in should they need it?

BTW, the 50BMG is already plenty potent enough for anything up to and including armored cars/trucks.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Ummm.....yes. The FBI does not really have much in they way of anti-material needs, hence the small purchase. Also, if they were faced with a situation that required anti-material capabilities they would fly them in, just like they fly HRT in if they need them. The FBI owns two C5 Galaxy cargo planes just for HRT. It is quite reasonable to think they could load an extra rifle or two when deploying.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

So the FBI only has two HRT teams?

How exactly would one employ a 20mm rifle in a hostage situation?

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

FBI HRT is comprised of more than 100 members. HRT does more than Hostage Rescue. HRT is FBI's SWAT. They handle any situations which require highly skilled hostage rescue or high risk tactical operations.

There aren't too many people or groups with light armor, so I can't really envision too many situations they could find themselves in which would require it. Most likely they got money to spend on new equipment and somebody thought adding a couple 20mm rifles would be cool.

My point is that this is not a really big deal. It is 2 rifles. If disparity of force concerns you you are free to purchase a 20mm rifle of your own. It is not like they bought ICBMs or 155mm howitzers.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

I brought this up this weekend with a friend who is an agent. He said it was probably for HRT teams. He could see situations where it would be necessary to hit a target through a heavy exterior wall. Other than that, he thought they might just be testing them out to see if there is a place for them in the Bureau.

FWIW:

He told me they are only allowed to use three different brands for service weapons: S&W, Glock, and H&K. Agents carry one of three calibers: 9mm, .40, and .45. He chose the Glock .40. He also LOVES his MP-5 in 9mm - said it practically shoots itself. He thought the FBI was getting their MP-5s in 10mm now, but he said that might have changed again because 10mm is going out.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

That's my point, there are over 100 members, and they are staged in multiple locations. IOW, two aren't enough to go around. Then there's the issue of one being single shot and the other being mag fed. Which leads one to believe that they would test the two to see if either fit into their 'needs'.

Then there is the fact that no parts or support items were ordered (other than the mags), so it seems hard to believe that they would be in service. Which brings me back to my original thought, either test/trial, or if you don't trust the .gov, maybe they have a job for one already lined up.

Oh, and by the way, Mr. Apologist, I'm not 'free' to buy a 12k firearm, as I have to pay all of my 'buy expensive toys' budget supporting an out of control federal, state, and local government, so that they can buy outrageous toys.:censored:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Assuming you make a middle class income, you could afford a 50 BMG rifle with some saving. It might take a year or two, but it can be done. A 20mm may be out of reach, but the fact is you CAN buy one legally. A 50BMG offers anti-material/long range punch at a relatively more affordable price. My point is that WE THE PEOPLE can own these, so this is not creating a disparity of force.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Read it again.

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

:yes: Yep..........and check this deal out !

http://www.onlylongrange.com/

http://www.onlylongrange.com/img/content/6301_6305.gif

http://www.onlylongrange.com/img/content/6301_35001.gif



:RockOn:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

SLV, read a tech manual for an issue arm. There are literally hundreds of items, from cleaning to armorer's tools to spare parts.

In that statement there is nothing but spare mags, suppressors, and non firing bolts.


Goldberg, who fills out the class III paperwork and passes the background check for the FBI?:23_1_22:

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

i hear there are for turkey hunting

Re: FBI to aquire 20mm Sniper Rifles
 

Why you of course silly. It is not a big deal. Some paperwork, $200, and a background check. Yeah, I don't like it, but it isn't scary, just a small pain in arse.